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Old 15-05-13, 03:28 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Windrush View Post
I would try this Dave, it may just get things moving. Have an extra Shredded Wheat and then take the complete crank assembly including flywheel out of the crankcase, 5 nuts hold it. Polish the crank and the keyway and oil it well, then get a thick block of wood and 'bump' the complete crank onto it vertically while holding the flywheel. Hopefully the weight of the flywheel will start it sliding and it should take the key with it. It seems brutal but sometimes needs must!

I did that once and buggered the flywheel as it rode up the tapered key making it tighter on the key until finally a big lump of the central boss of the flywheel around the key broke away.
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Old 15-05-13, 04:35 PM   #12
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Default Drilling a key.

Drilling is not too hard as long as you make a guide from a piece of SQUARE key the same width as you keyway. Use a lathe and 4 jaw chuck to drill a pilot hole the length of your guide to align with the CENTRE of the broken key. Use a long or extended drill smaller than the broken key thickness to drill right through it, then discard the guide and drill the key with a drill the same or slightly less thickness than the broken key. It should now collapse. Flywheel may loosen if you can place a woodblock under the crankpin and roll the flywheel round so it comes to a sudden stop on the block.
I am sure a site search will find a lot of help for your problem, and some novel solutions, 'cos you ain't Robinson Crusoe! Combustor.
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Old 15-05-13, 06:08 PM   #13
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I reckon taking the 5 nuts off behind the flywheel and taking the whole lot to a workshop somewhere with a 10 tonne press might be your only option, if there is any key visible then try welding again, be careful not to weld the key to the crankshaft though, if you do press it off then make a jig like Combustor said and drill the key first, will help the key collapse in on it self when you press it off. And make sure the shaft is really clean and free from burrs!

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Old 15-05-13, 08:59 PM   #14
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Wise words from Windrush and Appletop!!! The shaft and keyway need to be really clean of burrs and rust. The "dismantle and bump" method has always worked for me, along with some heat on the flywheel boss. One thing I've done with several engines which have given this problem, before replacing the "new" key, drill and tap a sensible sized hole in the "head-end" then You can make up a slide hammer for next time it has to come out!!
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Old 16-05-13, 04:35 AM   #15
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This is how I pulled both keys from my Lister CS 3.5/1. Butt the rod up to the end of the broken key, weld 2 short reinforcements either side of key to spread the pulling force, use a big lump of steel or whatever as a slide hammer. No heat involved (apart from welding) and copious flood of WD40 for a few days. It worked a treat!

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Old 16-05-13, 04:40 AM   #16
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No problem of you having a loan. Its all bloomin heavy though, so postage would be steep to yours and back.
Do you want me to post some more photos of it, as it is only a piece of scafolding tube with a threaded plate welded on the end, a lngth of stud, and something heavy to slide along the threaded bar. Should be easy to make if you can get the bits.

"You can only make as well as you can measure" Joseph Whitworth 1803-1887
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again but expecting different results."
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Old 16-05-13, 09:12 AM   #17
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A question I probably shouldn't have to ask as an alleged experienced engine man - why are some keys relieved down the centre of the top face, as in neseng's CS?

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Old 16-05-13, 09:29 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by nickh View Post
A question I probably shouldn't have to ask as an alleged experienced engine man - why are some keys relieved down the centre of the top face, as in neseng's CS?

I believe that most Lister keys are Nick, certainly all the ones that I have encountered. Regarding the groove two folk told me two different opinions, one that it was to make romoval easier (!) as there was less contact area, and that it was a channel for grease etc. Could it also be so that no foreign matter was trapped?
Touching wood I have never had a key break as the pulley tends to protect them, I have had the head come off though and ended up welding a fresh lump on to extract it. My first D type key was solid so I belted the boss of the flywheel with a hammer and drift, the key shot out like a bullet from a gun!

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Old 19-05-13, 10:07 AM   #19
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Thanks everyone, especially Andy and Neseng.

Well, I can confirm that *my* arc welding is not strong enough to pull the key out!!! I made up the same hammer as in Neseng's beautiful photos... welds snapped.

Still, I'll persevere - gotta get some new hacksaw blades to cut the top off and start all over again... gonna do some reading up on how to arc weld properly!

Most of the welds looked good and they did take some serious hammering but eventually cracked and then broke away...

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Old 19-05-13, 10:18 AM   #20
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The key on my fowler was really stuck in. I used the slide hammer method on that & it pulled the key off flush with the flywheel. I had no choice but to drill it out & pull the flwheel off with a puller. It fought me right to the end of the shaft. The shaft had been abused quite a bit at some time. I had to clean it up when i refitted the flywheel later. It's surprising how a small hammer mark can raise the surrounding metal. (there were lots of such marks,)
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