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Old 31-03-15, 08:26 AM   #1
Dan_pt
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Default The Unidentified Twin.

Hi, Some time ago there was a thread about an interesting twin cylinder engine for sale in Scotland, Thread is here.
http://www.stationary-engine.net/for...ad.php?t=39511
I was quite taken by this engine and I ended up buying it and it finally turned up yesterday. It is quite a tidy piece of design but sadly it has absolutely no markings on it anywhere. The seller said it has been dated at c1904, this will somehow need confirming.
Here are some photos of what I have got.


In the ebay ad, the word Napier on the water tank was covered with tape, the first thing I did when it turned up was to see what was underneath!



The crankcase is of an unusual design for a four stroke engine, it looks just like a two stroke or a dry sump, the oiler looks like it just keeps it topped up, I have not found an oil filler though.





Another feature that I have never seen before are the inlet valves. They are hidden under the covers fitted with the primer cups, these cups are opened by unscrewing the funnel section slightly. I lifted one cover off to reveal three little valves!



I have never seen anything like that......it has four valves per cylinder, neat!

Overall view of the engine with the exhaust refitted.



You probably can't see it from this photo but the rusty section inside the rim of the flywheel is actually machined conical, rather like it is for use with some sort of cone clutch arrangement.



So, before I can attempt to run it I need to establish how the lubrication is effected, clean up the ignition contacts and sort out a couple of trembler coils. It should make a nice little exhibit once it is running.

Dan
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Old 31-03-15, 08:47 AM   #2
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That's not a brass level plug in the third picture is it Dan??
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Old 31-03-15, 09:14 AM   #3
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Hi Barry, I think that bolt holds the back of the timing case onto the front of the engine. That said, I have just noticed a square headed plug next to the web directly under the crankshaft!

Dan
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Old 31-03-15, 09:18 AM   #4
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Fascinating, never seen that inlet valve arrangement before! Still looks like an early automotive unit to me, despite the text in ebay listing:-

Quote:
This Veteran engine has 105mm bore and has been dated by Malcolm Jeal at 1904 (the automatic inlet valves point to a date not much later than this) and the makes that used a 105mm bore (or imperial equivalent) include a number of American, French and British products, though Malcolm believes it is a British engine. It has four-studs securing the top water-manifold on each cylinder head which is unusual. It appears that the inlet manifold has been modified and that which is currently fitted looks to be an American unit (perhaps a Schebler).

It is unlikely that this was a car engine, but might be a marine or might have always been a stationary engine. It was bought from old mine workings in the 1990s by the New Zealand dealer Hans Compter.
Might be worth seeking out Mike Worthington-Williams, another automotive historian, for an opinion.

EDIT; BTW, if I'm doing my sums right, the 105mm bore makes it a 14hp unit (RAC rating) which rules out the early Napier 8hp twin.

NHH

Last edited by nickh; 31-03-15 at 10:21 AM.
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Old 31-03-15, 10:05 AM   #5
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Cheers Nick, I appreciate your input!
One part of it that I have managed to identify is the carburettor. It is off a Ford Model T.
http://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_mo...n-rebuilt.html

Doesn't really help with the identity of the engine as the manifold has been reworked to accept it.

Dan.
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Old 31-03-15, 10:26 AM   #6
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Just found this...
http://www.prewarcar.com/magazine/pr...-014444-2.html

Looking at his measurements the capacity comes out at around 2151cc.

Dan
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Old 31-03-15, 08:15 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by novo View Post
That's not a brass level plug in the third picture is it Dan??
I had a quick look to see if I could find a filler or level plug, there is an iron plug fitted into the starting end of the crankcase, this would only allow for about an inch of oil, surely not enough!
Perhaps it is supposed to run with a minimal amount of oil in the sump hence the drip oiler.

Dan.
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Old 31-03-15, 08:52 PM   #8
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Dan,
Can you take more side and end view photos?
You say that the engine came from NZ so that is raises the possibility of it being an engine manufactured here. There were a lot of engines built in NZ. I have never heard of an engine with three poppet inlet valves and the sump on your engine is not like any stationary or marine engines built here. However there are some features that are similar to some engines that Anderson's made. The priming cups look to be the same, the cylinders are very similar although most have the spark plugs on top. Anderson's also used a drip oiled on some of their engines to keep the oil level topped up
How would the magneto be mounted if it had one and is there a serial number on it somewhere. that could tell us a lot? What is the governing system?
Some engine makers did build experimental engines and yours could be one of those.
Merv.
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Old 01-04-15, 07:42 AM   #9
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Cheers Merv. I will take some more pictures of it for you later. I have had a look around it but I have not been able to find any serial numbers at all, there don't seem to be any casting numbers either......strange.

Dan
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Old 01-04-15, 07:13 PM   #10
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Hi, I have taken a few more pictures.


General view of the camshaft side, the lever in the middle is the decompressor.


The water manifold on the opposite side.


Here is the timing unit for the trembler coils.



The timing case is remote from the crankcase and mounted on the bearing housings.


This little thing is screwed into the side of the crankcase opposite to the camshaft, it looks like a banjo union to me although it is part of the threaded plug. I'm guessing it could be a combined filler and breather.


The flywheel end main bearing housing.


The manifolds and carb.


Finally the lubricator,


There is no governor fitted whatsoever so it was most probably variable speed. The timing bracket looks home made to me, I wondered if it had originally run a magneto but there is insufficient room under the manifolds to fit one. It looks like there is no access to the crankshaft at all with the sump on, there are no access doors etc. I think that the sump is a combined casting with the lower halves of the main bearings, quite a job to get the crank out!

Dan
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