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Old 12-10-18, 10:37 AM   #1
nickh
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Default Saving the Planet?

Hmm

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...00016843353279

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Old 12-10-18, 01:49 PM   #2
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Hmmm indeed - I don't speak French...

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Old 12-10-18, 02:32 PM   #3
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Carlos Tavares (boss of PSA)
"The world is crazy, the fact that the authorities are ordering us to go in a technological direction, that of the electric vehicle, is a big turning point.
I would not want in 30 years we discover something that is not as good as it looks, on the recycling of batteries, the use of rare materials on the planet, on the electromagnetic emissions of the battery in recharging situation?
How are we going to produce more clean electrical energy?
How to make the carbon footprint of an electric vehicle battery not an ecological disaster?
How to make sure that recycling a battery is not an ecological disaster?
How to find enough rare raw material to make the cells and chemistries of the batteries in the long term?
Who addresses the issue of clean mobility as a whole?
Who today is asking the question in a sufficiently broad way from a societal point of view to take into account all these parameters?
I worry as a citizen, because as a car manufacturer, I am not audible.
All this turmoil, all this chaos, will turn against us because we will have made bad decisions in emotional contexts. "

STÉPHANE LHOMME
(Director of the Nuclear Observatory)
- The life cycle of an electric vehicle makes it as polluting as a thermal vehicle.
To subsidize it does not make sense, explains the director of the Nuclear Observatory, Stéphane Lhomme.
The manufacture of batteries is so CO 2 emitting that it must have traveled from 50,000 to 100,000 km in electric car .... To begin to be less producer of CO² than a thermal car. That's 15 to 30 km a day, 365 days a year, for 10 years!

AFP / DANIEL ROLAND
However, contrary to what most people believe, subject to continual propaganda by politicians and industrialists, the electric car is no more virtuous for the climate than the thermal car, petrol or diesel.
These are the conclusions of an already long-standing study by the French Environment and Energy Management Agency (ADEME), deliberately ignored by the government (LCA principles based on energy balance greenhouse gas emissions and other environmental impacts induced by all sectors of electric vehicles and thermal vehicles by 2012 and 2020, (November 2013)
Knowing that these cars are used mainly for short trips, it is likely that the mileage needed to consider themselves "virtuous" will never be achieved.
In addition, all the CO² emitted by an electric car is sent into the atmosphere before even a single kilometer is traveled.
While it is widely claimed that the electric car does not emit fine particles, as reported in Science and Life magazine (January 2015), "tires, brakes and road wear emit almost as many microparticles as the diesel ".

The electric car emits certainly less particles than the thermal car, since it does not have a muffler, but it has many brakes, tires, and rolls on the tar!
In the end, the electric car is not more environmentally friendly than the thermal car.
The public money devoted to its development is therefore totally unjustified.
But these are astronomical sums:
- The government has launched a plan to install 7 million charging stations at around 10,000 euros each, a cost of around 70 billion euros.
It is also poignant to see elected officials of small municipalities, believing to make a gesture for the environment, break the municipal piggy bank to afford a terminal;
- The "green" bonus on the purchase of an electric car exceeds € 10,000 per vehicle, often supplemented by a premium from the region.
Almost all buyers are wealthy households, because these vehicles are very expensive: once again, the money of all is offered to the most privileged.
In fact, in the land of the atom, all means are good to "boost" the consumption of electricity, down continuously for years.
Because the electric car in France can be considered as a "nuclear car": almost all charging stations installed are connected to the ordinary electrical network, 80% nuclear.
We must not be fooled by the certificates put forward by Mr. Bolloré and his Autolib (Paris), Bluecub (Bordeaux) and Bluely (Lyon), ensuring that they are recharged with renewable energies: it is only a question of writing games; the electricity used is the same as elsewhere.
We are not here promoting the thermal car, itself an environmental calamity.
But, precisely, nobody would have the idea to offer 10 000 euros with the purchase of a diesel car, to reserve to him parking places and to fill his tank with price broken ...
This is a very good analysis showing that our policies (and greens) make us show:
The paranoia of the diesel is only for motorists!
Trucks, coaches, ships, are excluded!
Just to pinpoint the degree of paranoia of the most virulent detractors of the diesel vehicle, it must be revealed to them the data of the marine industry which has demonstrated that considering the size of the engines and the quality of the fuel used, the 40 largest vessels -cargos of the world pollute as much as all of the 760 million cars on the planet.
You know, these container ships that feed us with products that we made in our offshore factories, today they burn 10,000 tons of fuel for a return trip between Asia and Europe.
These unfortunate 40 ships are part of a flotilla of 3,500, to which must be added the 17,500 tankers that make up all of the 100,000 ships that ply the seas.
To avoid leaving the maritime domain, remember that the French pleasure fleet is about 500,000 units, including 5,000 yachts over 60 meters, and that the most average of them burns about 900 liters of fuel in just one hour , while the 24% of French homes that heat fuel oil have trouble filling their tanks for the winter.
To continue on the path of paranoid schizophrenia, take into account the entire fishing fleet and 4.7 million trucks in transit across France and the thousands of planes crisscrossing the sky.
To complete this little fable, let's not forget the essential agricultural field where the average energy consumption is 101 liters of fuel per hectare.

Translation by Google
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Old 12-10-18, 03:52 PM   #4
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I saw this on BBC business a couple of days ago - link

Stuart.
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Old 12-10-18, 04:02 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martinpaff View Post
Hmmm indeed - I don't speak French...

MP
Odd, facebook translation comes up automatically when I click link. Anyway, thanks Phillip for posting google translation.

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Old 12-10-18, 04:47 PM   #6
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What he says is absolutely true.

The idea that electric vehicles are non polluting is complete bunkum !
The only thing they do remove from city centres are the supposedly nasty Nitrogen Oxides.
The production of the vast majority of electricity results in CO2, just made somewhere else !

If & when fusion power is available then things will be looking up for electric vehicles as we'll have an almost inexhaustible source of power.
It's been promised "within 40 years" for a very long time ! Will we see it ? - I hope so !

Nuclear has far reaching issues with future decommissioning & as the article states batteries are really in the same league with regards future disposal and also with their manufacture.

The complete shortsightedness of our governments in demonising the diesel vehicle has resulted in a significant increase in CO2 with people switching to petrol vehicles.

Governments, unfortunately, are incapable of looking to the real future but just to the next election !
Surely they need to think globally and to look at the cost benefit analysis for the entire production chain & then decide what's best for the world.

Cheers,
Jim
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Old 12-10-18, 05:17 PM   #7
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Ah, that's what it says...

I find it hard to believe that there is anybody stupid enough to believe electric cars are the way forward...

The governments like the idea of moving the pollution out of their city centres, into somebody else's back yard, which is all that electric vehicles do.

When an electric car can make 220bhp and 450 ftlbs for 400 miles, then take 5 minutes to recharge I might change my mind...

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Old 12-10-18, 05:39 PM   #8
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Audi e-tron ...

408 PS (300kW), 0-62mph in less than 6 seconds, range 248 miles.
Can be 100% charged in 50 mins.

However you need an 150kW charging station for that !

Jaguar I Pace ...

400 PS, 0-60mph in 4.5 seconds, range 296 miles.
An 168 mile range can be charged in an hour at a 50kW charging station.

They're getting there !

Jim
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Old 12-10-18, 05:45 PM   #9
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Slighly aside but how many of you have noticed people particularly women who are walking around our engines with masks or scarfs over their faces, I noticed it last year but this year its been more prevelant.
Martin P
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Old 12-10-18, 06:54 PM   #10
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The manufacturers recharge rates is questionable depending on how rapidly the battery has been discharged due to heat build up in the cells , like after motorway driving. And what's going to happen to caravans and trailers as electric and hybrids are unable to tow them ?
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